From An Experienced Lab Rat

[altitude]

Wow so they completely had to reboot the forum and wipe it clean? I noticed it was down for about 3 months, wonder what happened?

Might as well break the ice. I've been doing studies for the last year full time.

First began when I got back from Japan and didn't know what I wanted to do next, and stumbled across the whole healthy patient thing after reading a online PDF called, "How to make money as a college student" which mentioned the flyers on campuses for psychology tests and other very small time volunteer studies - which doesn't hold a candle to the medical one's that require over night stays.

One quick rant:

If you are the 1 in 20 participant who acts more whinny and complain far more than you'd ever dream to try if this was a real job, or if being inside a facility makes you act like "that one time you went to prison" please don't do these studies, at all. Ever.

The one complaint I have about this occupation is the companies don't do a more thorough psychological back ground check. For the most part it isn't an issue but when these individuals do show up it leaves a lasting impression on the experience. And they don't get kicked out because by then there would be too much money to lose and research data gone.


If you've never done a healthy patient study know that it's such easy money but very important to have a hobby, otherwise you'll spend 20-30 days watching tv and playing games, and I'm sure that can become draining very quickly. When I'm 'doing my time' at a clinic I put in 6-10 hours a day on 3D modeling and without the last year I went from complete amateur to somebody who makes money from selling my work online. That's time I would never of had out in the "real world" with a "real job"; so the $190-220 a day you make is only part of the compensation if you use your time to improve yourself.

My experience as a lab rat has involved Charles River, Washington state, PPD at Austin Texas, Quintiles and PRA at Kansas city, and a couple up in Omaha/Lincoln Nebraska. It can be a chance to travel around the country, such as in New York city, California, and Florida as well. There's even one in Hawaii.

Getting into studies regularly should be absolutely no problem for you. Screen early. If there are ten screenings for a particular study - make sure you are within the first 5. Take Milk thistle to clean out your liver and concentrated iron tablets with a healthy dosage of Vitamin C (from grape juice or Tang perhaps - avoid caffeine for an hour or two while your body absorbs it!), and do aerobic exercise such as running for 30-45 minutes a day, and I promise your rate of getting in will be very high.

For cheap living while doing the screening and traveling - consider "Hostels" in the area which are much cheaper than motels. "WWW.Couchsurfing.Com" for a couch to crash out on for a couple days to a week, or if your doing it full time consider the Scooby Doo green mystery van with fridge, bed, and due to price of gas you may want to consider running a natural gas, or cooking oil engine.

But that reminds me. Don't forget to save ALL of your gas recipes, and airplane tickets as a "Write off" on your taxes. In addition to cellphone bill, and other expenses, as you are considered as "self employed' This can really help at the end of the year.

Also you would think these facilities would be good about keeping the temperature at a stable 72-75 degrees but it can actually range anywhere from 60 during the day to 80 at night. Might want to break a sweeter, long johns, and a little portable fan. On the longer studies for entertainment a game system, lcd screen, and/ or laptop can make the stay much more tolerable. Having your own internet can be really nice too. Often times when the house is full the speed slows to a crawl.

Clearwire is a really cheap mobile broadband with no internet cap and available nearly everywhere. It's what I used after I got sick of Cricket's 1gb limit. I can even set mine up as a wifi hotspot and a group of us can use it to play multiplayer games.



As for getting in, I've done 6-8 studies in a row and have yet to be rejected from the screening or be a "back up".

Depending on your preference you can find studies that pay low to moderate amount which are spread out over 1-3 months (or more), which saves you the hassle of screening frequently, and involve mostly "out patient visits" which just take 15 minutes to 2 hours of time every couple of days, or for big bucks there's the 20-30 days straight which can go anywhere from $3,000 to $8,000 in one lump sum. Actually I just saw a radiation study where they had to hold the volunteers for an extra 5 days for 35 days total - they made a cool $10,000.


If you use my name as a "referral" I will send you half the money via paypal or Moneygram. You can count on me as it's worth it especially if you do multiple companies.

And I will use your name if I go to a new company for the same deal.

If you have any questions about studies in general or about my offer just send a email or post via forum.

or contact me at


Latitude


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@clear.Net.


Hopefully I don't get spam from this.

[micah77]

thanks for all the info bro!.... im new too studies only got a couple under my belt which i have done in vegas, I wanna start branching out and do some traveling and get some studies in all over the country, im kinda looking for the long studies which pay the bigger bucks, i been surfing the site looking for those, not sure really which companys offer the longer studies and im not sure how they work.. meaning do they sign up alot of people then ya go screen and then have too sweat it out to see if ya get picked from a raffle?... meaning im kinda a lil leary of traveling around but only getting screenings at places but not getting picked b/c so many people are there for such lil spots.....

thanks for your time... micah

[mike]

Yeah thats a drag the board got wiped, I had made a lot of entries in it.
I have done around 20 studies in the past 3 to 4 years at these clinics;
Icon San Antonio
Cedra San Antonio (and when they were in Austin)
Covance Dallas, Evansville, (and when they were in Austin, also)
Quintiles
Cetero St. Charles

I have screened 3 times at PPD but have yet to get into a study, they pay a lot but can be a pain in the ***.

Cedra is reliable and I usually get in, but they don't usually have studies that pay so much or have convenient dates and time periods.

I have had normal expectable difficulties at most of the clinics, There are two that I would not recommend: Cetero in St. Charles - they pay substandard, they do not give a crap about your comfort or entertainment, and they rarely have good paying studies.

I would also strongly not recommend Celerion in Phoenix - they also pay too little, and don't provide much for participants, and they have a completely retarded od for getting into a study - everyone has to call in at the same time the day after the screening; I have screened there three times and have not gotten in after wasting a lot of time and gas, and sitting there redialing again and again and again for over a half hour.

I am not a picky person at all and I don't expect the clinics to kiss our asses, but it's not too much to ask that they provide modest accommodations for us;
Cetero had us sitting up straight for 2 times 8 hours each, in cheap chairs with little padding on the seat and no padding on the arms, and they didn't have basic outlets available for laptops and other electronics.

Celerion has no wifi, I mean come on, with how much money they get paid for these studies they can't put up a couple of routers?

But really, I dislike the substandard pay from these clinics more than anything else, as I fear it can pull down the pay from other clinics also. You can expect to make less than $200 a day at Celerion or Cetero, as opposed to more like $235-$250 at most places.

[David Grey]

Yeah, sorry everyone. Actually the board had been busted for over a year. I was able to fix it occasionaly but I gave up. This board should be much more stable, has more flexibility and should be more effective.

Paul
Admin

[altitude]

Hey Paul! I think I saw you one time while doing a study at PPD in Austin. You have become a celebrity Your website is 100x better than using "ClinicalConnections.gov" or any of the other never updated "master list" of study sites.

Micah; From the study places I've done at like PPD at Austin Texas and Quintiles in Kansas City. These are two of the biggest facilities. They have many overnight stays, pay alot, and often the groups are big. Really though it's not the size of the group that matters but just how early you screen. If you are healthy with good labs and you screen halfway through or less then it's practically guaranteed to get in. But if you had to choose between one or the other, Quintiles is preferable... PDD can be very finicky about their lab reports. Also if you have a friend who's interested in doing it too - that can really help to curve down transportation costs.

Mike; I use Clearwire for mobile internet but without that if a clinic told me they didn't provide internet I swear I'd just walk out the door. Being locked away from the outside world as we are, that really shows they just think of labrats as cash cows to be herded at their convince. And for every study 100,000+ cash flow in and out. Lol, $50-100 a month for a strong internet for them is such a drop in the bucket.

One issue about all the study locations though is how there is no cap on how much data a single person can use. So if a whole bunch of people leave and the building is nearly empty except for maybe a group of 10, and 3 of those people are using the internet to download movies and games from torrent, then the connection is still slow as hell for everybody else.

[micah77]

.........Micah; From the study places I've done at like PPD at Austin Texas and Quintiles in Kansas City. These are two of the biggest facilities. They have many overnight stays, pay alot, and often the groups are big. Really though it's not the size of the group that matters but just how early you screen. If you are healthy with good labs and you screen halfway through or less then it's practically guaranteed to get in. But if you had to choose between one or the other, Quintiles is preferable... PDD can be very finicky about their lab reports. Also if you have a friend who's interested in doing it too - that can really help to curve down transportation costs.............


Thanks altitude for the info.. i will check out them places... I think id prefer too do the longer studies then the short ones that are chopped up...When ya say " healthy with good labs" do ya mean like no problems with blood draws meaning it flows good with good veins?......Also when ya said " screen halfway through" are ya meaning be early or one of the first ones to get into the screenings so ya get picked if you clear the screening?.... sorry for the dumb questions, im new too the studies game lol so i dont know the terms yet.....

[David Grey]

Well, I'm glad ya'll enjoy the site. yeah, the internet... thats an issue at most clinics it seems. but save yourself the aggravation and get clear or sprint 4g. incidentally, i have both. though i've heard that 4g doesn't work at quintiles, perhaps they fixed that by now.

[altitude]

Healthy just means general good health. Not having small veins helps but most males wont have that problem anyways. If you do aerobic exercise a little each day like running, jogging, swimming. Don't have high blood pressure, or high liver enzymes (from drinking alchohol a lot, for instance.)

As for screening; be sure to schedule an appointment for as early on as you can.

For instance; The study starts on April 20th. They are doing screenings from April 1st until April 10th.... You want to schedule on the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, or 5th.... but if you have to schedule later than that, it starts to become a little risky.

[micah77]

thanks for the info AL.... i have one more question.. whats the standard for how many studies you can do in a month.. is the rule for most 1 study for 1 month?

[allisvein]

Having also done many studies through the years (i.e. approx. 20 in past 4yrs.), your information is accurate... I agree with the higher level of screening might be needed, but they should also have a rating system, so those who are not "fit" for long term studies get directed to weekenders only, or none at all... For example, PPD is a fine site overall, but I and many I know have had bad experiences with other volunteers there. Also, at Parexel in MD too.

A friend of mine who has done studies for years has made similar observations too. He believes for example that screening could be so easy to be fairer, and balanced... (and he wasn't thinking about having FOX news on in the lobby... LOL)

Anyway, he suggests that PPD for example have a system of ONLY releasing studies at the end of business day, once the recruiter lines are OFF for the day. That way, ALL can simply check ONCE a day say between 7pm and 7am and KNOW ALL studies that have come online. This would forever END the incessant calling, "is that $10K study yet...?" Then as little as 30 min. later, is that $10K Study yet...?" YOU ALL KNOW WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT...

It seems quite reasonable, and would be a WIN-WIN situation.

As I understand his suggestion, ALL would have equal opportunity to schedule a screening the following day when the RECRUITER PHONES START RINGING... AND, if they (i.e. PPD) know that there is a $7K-$12K (there have even been $13k+ studies recently...!) study to in the AM, they can man the phones accordingly... See, WIN-WIN... :-) Then simply have a message on the line before recruiters answer stating that study # ... is currently closed for screening. (and immediately update that status on the site of course...)

What are everybody's thoughts on this type of approach to screening...?

PS--As far as "rating" or "grading" volunteers, he thinks a scale like ABC would work.
Each study would rank you based on "being on time", etc. ALL would start as a C on there first study, and be limited to a study under 3 weeks in length to start... once you have done 2 studies you could have an "A" status for example, and they (i.e. PPD) could then limit screening for long-term in-house studies (say 30 day studies and longer...) to ONLY those who have SHOWN their level of commitment...

Again, we are wondering what fellow volunteers think about such things... THANK YOU.

[mike]

I'm not trying to be negative, but rather realistic; I think to get any of these clinics to improve any of their policies and modus operandi would require a huge campaign of complaints to them. If you could somehow get negative attention focused on them by some largish media source maybe that would do it.

It's just no skin off their butts if we participants waste a lot of time, gas, money, and cell phone minutes trying to get into a study; and they don't care if there are a couple idiots in the study as long as they don't go nuts and/or get violent. And I'm sure they don't pay their recruiters that much so they don't mind if they have to waste a lot of time either.

Personally, I vote with my feet; the clinics that are reliable and don't jerk me around all the time are the ones that I go to, the others I avoid like the plague. It's understandable that sometimes there will be a hiccup getting into a study but if it is always the clinic's fault and not yours, write the place off.

And as for having to deal with the participants who act like jerks in the study, that's life. You run into morons everywhere you go. With all the studies I have done I have definitely had times that I had friction with another subject or seen it between others, but it has never risen to the level that I had to go to the clinic staff and complain. Many of the people you meet in the studies come from backgrounds and have attitudes you would not otherwise be exposed to in normal life. And frankly, some of the people are a little whack. You just have to be a little circumspect.

[sumguy2011]

hey whats your couchsurf link?
do u visit the midwest ever?
theres a gentlemen in indiana i think youd like to meet-one lab rat to another

[vark]

gentleman in indiana here. arbitrary aardvark at couchsurfing. run a crash pad for lab rats in indy, 3 of us right now. i was probably the most prolific poster on the old board. personally i'm kind of phasing out of lab ratting. as i get older, more and more places dont like my ekg, or have some other issue.
aside from quintiles once way back in the day, i found paul's site 4 years ago (ish?) after i was getting rejected at lilly. made $17K year one, 13K y2, 7K y3, and nothing this year. got sent home and banned at quintiles for ekg, study cancelled at jasper, sent home by cetero (puked),i'm waiting out a year ban for a false positive nie at kendle, i'm effectively banned at covance because i asked them to follow their own rules so they said a i was a troublemaker. i need to get around to seeing abbott's heart doctor before i can go back there.

currently just getting by as a plasma donor. i'll probably have to get a real job this year.
altitude's advice is good. bring a thermometer - it's easier to ***** about "hey it's 59 degrees in here!" instead of "i feel cold". find out in advance if you can bring your own pillow, blanket.
you can't do the hawaii one unless you live there.
i can echo the bad recommendation for celerion. they'll screen 100 people when they only need 5,and the 5 they pick will be people in preferred position because they've done studies there before.
worst place i ever was was arkansas research. i doubt they are still .
cetero is ok, for what it is, low pay, no amenities, short stays. easy to get into.
does anybody know a place i could crash in austin sometime this summer? i'd like to screen at ppd. it takes too long for a couchsurf, too short to rent an apartment. willing to pay soing nominal.
nice to see this forum back up. i didnt like that capcha, took me 4 tries.

[mike]

Hey vark, are you near Evansville? I might be doing a study there in a month or two.
I just moved back to CA, after living in Austin for 5 years, I can give you some good recommendations on weekly motels there if you want. There is also a hostel near PPD that I stopped and looked at once. It seems pretty cool, but I did not stay there.

[mikemontanaro]

I just registered on this web site today. I have a wife and two kids to take care of and am in need of an oppertunity to make some money. I look at this website and am overwhelmed with information. If anyone could just tell me how to start and how to apply for a study it would be much appreciated.